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To Drink or not to Drink?

Last post 09-26-2008 2:20 PM by Doc. 20 replies.
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  • 02-16-2007 9:02 AM

    • Doc
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    To Drink or not to Drink?

    To Drink or not to Drink???

    To Drink or not to Drink article from pastor Marco Bravo:

    great website:  www.vargasbravo.com/resources/witb.htm   


    by Ps Marco Bravo

    The Bible has much to say about wine, alcohol and intoxicating beverages. There seems to be so much controversy in the body of Christ about the subject. So many different views, yet the Bible is very plain and clear on the subject!

    Let's explore it...

    Notice the conduct Prescribed for Priests by God in the Old Testament...

    Lev 10:8-11(NKJV)
    8 Then the LORD spoke to Aaron, saying:
    9 "Do not drink wine or intoxicating drink, you, nor your sons with you, when you go into the tabernacle of meeting, lest you die. It shall be a statute forever throughout your generations,
    10 that you may distinguish between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean,
    11 and that you may teach the children of Israel all the statutes which the LORD has spoken to them by the hand of Moses."

    • Say this with me "No alcoholic beverage may enter the presence of God!"
    • God very clearly gives a statue, or command, ordinance that is to be observed FOREVER, not just Old Testament times!
    • What is that command? Not to consume any alcoholic beverage! None! No exceptions!
    • Now some might argue and say "Well, God said 'when they go into the tabernacle', which means they could do so outside of the tabernacle!"
    • Really? Let's take a look...

    John 2:19-21(NKJV)
    19
    Jesus answered and said to them, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up."
    20 Then the Jews said, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?"
    21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body.

    • Another name for the tabernacle of God, is the temple of God. It is the place where He dwells on earth.
    • In the Old testament it was at first a tent, then an actual building (Ac 7:44-47). And in the New Testament EVERY believer is the 'temple' or 'tabernacle' of God! The following verses clarify this further...

    1 Cor 3:16-17(NKJV)
    16
    Do you not know that you are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?
    17 If anyone defiles the temple of God, God will destroy him. For the temple of God is holy, which temple you are.

    1 Cor 6:19-20(NKJV)
    19
    Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own?
    20 For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God's.

    • Say this with me: "I am the Temple of God!"
    • Which means that I may not defile the temple with ANY alcoholic drink!
    Now, someone might say that, that ordinance was for priests only, that's true! But it still includes us, even more so...

    1 Peter 2:9(NKJV) But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation , His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;

    Rev 1:6(KJV) And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

    • Every New Testament believer is a 'priest'!!!
    • Therefore this everlasting ordinance applies to EVERY believer!
    • Firstly based on the fact that we are the temple of God, and secondly that we are New Testament priests!
    • Some people say it was only applicable on duty and not off duty. Then answer this question, based on salvation and the verses above:
      • When are you not a priest?
      • We are on duty 24/7!
      • The Holy Spirit lives in me 24/7!
    • How can we argue with that!!!
    Special caution to those in leadership in the church... The following verses are explicit in their explanation that those in leadership positions in the New Testament church, should take even stricter precaution not to consume ANY alcoholic beverages!

    1 Tim 3:1-3((NKJV)
    1
    This is a faithful saying: If a man desires the position of a bishop, he desires a good work.
    2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach;
    3 not given to wine...

    Titus 1:7(NKJV) For a bishop must be blameless, as a steward of God, not self-willed, not quick-tempered, not given to wine, not violent, not greedy for money,

    • Which part of 'not' do we not understand!?
    • The word 'Bishop' can also be translated as 'elder, overseer' - it refers to anyone in a position of leadership in the church!
    • Notice it says 'NOT given to WINE', not some, not a little, not on special occasions, not a small glass over a meal - NOT means NOT, that's it!!!
    • Let's take a look at the original Greek language:

    The word 'not' is Strong's number 3361, and it can also be translated as 'expressing an absolute denial, implying a negative answer, never, nothing, without'.

    • Couldn't be any clearer than that!!!
    Our reaction... Let's quit trying to find ways to justify the subject and accept God's Word for what it says, and let's DO what it says. After all, unconditional obedience is the only guarantee that we will enjoy God's abundant blessing and prosperity in our lives!

    Job 36:11(NKJV) If they obey and serve Him, They shall spend their days in prosperity, And their years in pleasures.

    Reservations... Someone might say 'Why did Paul tell Timothy to drink a little wine for his stomach?' (1 Tim 5:23), or what about Jesus turning the water into wine (John 2:7-9)?

    How do we begin to explain what looks like a contradiction?

    It’s very simple, here is really what is happening… In the Hebrew language there are 3 words translated to wine in the OT, one is strong drink.   The first we will look at is spelled ‘yayin’…
    • This is a generic word and is used approximately 141 times in the Old Testament, to indicate various kinds of fermented and unfermented wine.
    • Neh 5:18 – fermented use
    • Isa 16:10 – unfermented use
    • Deals with fermented and unfermented wine.
    • It specifically refers to the grape juice or the liquid which the vine yields.
    • It may be used for new or old, sweet or sour, fermented or unfermented, intoxicating or intoxicating.
    • So the specific sense in which we must often assign to the word arises not from the word itself, but from the connection in which it stands.
    • Since the word juice appears only once in the OT (SS 8:2), where it is referred to the juice of a pomegranate, which is linked to the grapevine where it grew and thus refers to the fresh juice in it’s unfermented state. Which is often the case.
    • Gen 14:18 Melchizedek, the word is used here, remember that He was the priest of the God most high, also remember that in Lev 10:9-10 the priest were prohibited from drinking wine with alcohol.
    • Ps 4:7 the source of gladness may be from corn and wine, but gladness reaches it’s peak from appreciating God’s goodness. The context of gladness is thus appreciating God’s goodness and provision, at it’s height. This gladness comes as a result of God’s provision of our abundance.
    • Jer 40:10 it is brought in from the field and harvest, thus it is unfermented and intoxicating.

    Another word translated wine is ‘tirosh’…

    • This Hebrew word means new wine or harvest wine, and it’s used approximately 38 times in the OT, and it ALWAYS refers to an unfermented drink!
    • Always refers to the unfermented fruit of the vine, referring to juice that is still in the grape cluster.
    • ‘tirosh’ means fresh or new wine, it includes all kinds of sweet juices.
    • It does NOT include fermented wine.
    • It has a blessing in it.
    • Fermented wine is a mocker (Prov 20:1) and brings drunkenness, but unfermented wine bears a blessing in that (Isa 55:1).
    • This is the unfermented grape juice.
    • Translated as wine in the OT means new wine or grape juice, and sometimes refers to the Jews stealing the grapes before it is pressed.
    • Gen 27:28 it is grape juice.
    • When we use the word wine today, it is assumed that it’s alcoholic, so if you want the non-alcoholic, you have to ask for grape juice.
    • In the OT when you used the word, it included everything about the grape, the grape itself, the seed, the juice, even if it was fermented.
    • Note the association with corn, when they had the harvest feast – Num 18:12-13 freshly pressed to the altar.
    • Deut 7:13 corn, wine and oil… the fresh pressed again – corn and wine is fresh from the harvest.
    • Deut 11:14 corn & wine, the juice still in the grapes.
    • Jud 9:13 the juice still in the grapes, in it’s unfermented state that it cheers God and man, because it represents blessed abundant harvest!
    • Neh 10:37 spoken of as the offering of the first fruits, fermentation would have been impossible, but if any doubt remains Neh 10:39 settles it.
    • Isa 65:8 unfermented wine.
    • Joel 3:18 the exciting prophecy about the millennial blessings! This wine is not fermented and is not intoxicating!

    Another Hebrew word is ‘sheka’…

    • It’s translated as ‘strong drink’ and it is used 23 times in the OT.
    Clarity... There are two kinds of wine that are spoken of in the OT: fermented and unfermented. Thus by understanding the word in it’s context and by the help of the Holy Spirit, it has been established that the word is used in it’s unfermented context 71 times, and as fermented 70 times in the OT. Symbolically intoxicating wine speaks of judgment and wrath – in contrast non-intoxicating wine speaks of spiritual blessings (e.g. Isa 55:1).   So we see that these are the 3 primary Hebrew used in the OT testament for wine, and you will only know whether it was used in the fermented or unfermented way is if you look at context of the scripture…
    • You also need the Holy Spirit to  give you some revelation knowledge and spiritual understanding in order to accurately interpret it,
    • You also need revelation and spiritual understanding of God’s character and what He is like.
    Historically... Many wines of the ancients were boiled or filtered to prevent fermentation, and these were often considered the best wines. How about that? Also, people we addicted to the sweet drink, because it was such a commodity, simply because they did not have refrigeration the way we do. So they would often boil it into a syrup that way they could add water to it and still enjoy the juice. They would go to extremes to keep it from fermenting. Another method was that they kept the juice in very cold cisterns to prevent it from fermenting. They went to great lengths to do so.  

    In the Greek there is a word spelled ‘oinos’...

    • This is used in the NT for fermented and unfermented wine, so it’s imperative that we look at the application to understand correctly.
    • We need revelation from the Holy Ghost to rightly divide the Word of God (Col 1:9-10).

    About a century ago, some reputable Greek and Hebrew Scholars set forth solid evidence, showing that the major words that were translated “wine” in scripture, for example in the Hebrew it was the word “yayin” and in the Greekonios”.

    That either one of these two words could either mean fermented or unfermented (grape juice).

    And the research of these men clearly demonstrated that the context of divine approval or disapproval in any given passage, was a determining factor for interpretation, rather then the innate (not established/unlearned) meaning if these words. Consequently the church has been able to speak against the use of alcohol in any society since then.

    Therefore is both words, “yayin” and “onios” can be translated as fermented and unfermented, we need the Holy Ghost to reveal to us what it’s context is, how that word is being used!

    Alcohol is never approved by God in any amount by the obedient Christian.

    Alcohol is probably the most dangerous drug in any culture, because it’s complete acceptance by society, it’s total availability to the populous, and it’s devastating affect to every area of life, including families, marriages, health, safety, violence, employment and government.

    Final thought... I do not drink alcoholic liquors, I have better use for my head. To put alcohol in the human brain is like putting sand in the bearings of an engine’ ~Thomas Edison.
    Doc
    Jesus is Lord!
    www.fofmc.net
    http://cg.cfaith.com/blogs/doc
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  • 02-16-2007 1:28 PM In reply to

    • Bisnut
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    Amen!
    —Bisnut
    • Post Points: 5
  • 02-16-2007 4:30 PM In reply to

    • mbuttler777
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    This is all very interesting.  As someone who battled with alcohol and drugs prior to my walk with the Lord (and when I was backslidden) I do not allow myself to drink period and I avoid functions, including weddings, where alcohol will be served.  I know that people are always watching me to see if I've really changed and I don't want to be a stumbling block to others.  Thanks for the scripture.

    • Post Points: 20
  • 09-08-2007 12:53 PM In reply to

    • Doc
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    Sword [sword] Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    thanks
    Doc
    Jesus is Lord!
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    http://cg.cfaith.com/blogs/doc
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  • 09-08-2007 2:19 PM In reply to

    • AmeriKan
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    I like what Marilyn Hickey says about drinking.  "A sipping Christian is a slipping Christian."
    God is FAITHFUL!!!!!
    • Post Points: 35
  • 09-08-2007 8:34 PM In reply to

    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

     

    Amen Doc! Yes
    The WORD, The SPIRIT, And PRAYER
    are a 'must' in our lives.

    avatar by - Danny Hahlbohm
    ©Copyright 2007 All Rights Reserved
    http://www.inspired-art.com


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  • 09-08-2007 8:35 PM In reply to

    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

     

     

     

    AmeriKan:
    I like what Marilyn Hickey says about drinking.  "A sipping Christian is a slipping Christian."

    I never heard that before but I really I like that!

    The WORD, The SPIRIT, And PRAYER
    are a 'must' in our lives.

    avatar by - Danny Hahlbohm
    ©Copyright 2007 All Rights Reserved
    http://www.inspired-art.com


    • Post Points: 20
  • 09-08-2007 10:00 PM In reply to

    • Doc
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    Thats a good one! 
     
     
     
     
     
    Doc
    Jesus is Lord!
    www.fofmc.net
    http://cg.cfaith.com/blogs/doc
    • Post Points: 20
  • 09-09-2007 6:38 PM In reply to

    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    I agree, and disagree.  I believe the phrase, "be not given to wine", means that you have not given yourself to it in the sense that it controls you.  Having a 'drink' once in a while in and of itself is not sin, as long as it does not lead to excess.  Paul says, " All things are permisable, but not all are beneficial."  It is between each person and God as to their personal conviction on drinking alcohol.

    All that being said, I still agree that we should not drink alcohol.  But let us not be given to condemnation of those who do.  Let us love them, and let God convict them in His time in their lives.  Your message is a timely word for this generation and these times in the church, let us pass this information on in love and compassion and let God do the work on other's hearts!  They will stop drinking when they decide to obey Him, not when we tell them to :)

    Thank you for all of the great references, I now have something to share and back up my convictions when someone asks me about this, which they have... and I haven't had an answer.  THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU!!

    Be an informed voter, go to www.votesmart.org and learn about the candidates!
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  • 09-09-2007 9:31 PM In reply to

    • AmeriKan
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    Is it condemnation or conviction we have here....more than likely the latter.  The original post could
    hardly be improved upon.  The Word of God is "sharper than a  two edged sword."  The preacher/
    writer crafted an excellent exegesis of the scripture on this subject.  The Bible says, how can they hear
    (know and understand) without a preacher.  Jesus went into the synagogue and swiftly dealt a blow
    to what was an unjust practice.  Not only did Jesus come as a lamb to the slaughter and a savior of
    reconciliation but he also came to "divide and judge."  We have to understand that the preaching of
    the Word sets the captives free but it comes through conviction, repentance and forgiveness.  "He
    sends His servants, as flames of fire."  Fire destroys and removes that which is dead and does not
    belong, so new life can come forth.  This is one of the purposes of the spoken Word of God.  Our prayer
    should be that His Word, "will not return void but will accomplish that which it was sent to do."  Thankyou
    Marco Bravo for bringing this liberating word on a "touchy subject."
    God is FAITHFUL!!!!!
    • Post Points: 5
  • 09-24-2007 11:15 PM In reply to

    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    My whole idea is, if you want to get yourself intoxicated, even a little, you should ask yourself, "Why? " .  I'm not condemning you.  I know why.  I'm only saying if we are believers let's start where we are and say, " I want to drink.  I need something every now and then.  I want to know how to wake up so full of You, Jesus that I don't look for comfort anywhere but in You.  Please, help me."  I'm not suggesting that you're an alchoholic if you drink sometimes.  I'm suggesting that if you have fellowship with Jesus, you won't want to drink. 
    • Post Points: 20
  • 09-25-2007 2:14 AM In reply to

    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    realityrules:
    My whole idea is, if you want to get yourself intoxicated, even a little, you should ask yourself, "Why? " .  I'm not condemning you.  I know why.  I'm only saying if we are believers let's start where we are and say, " I want to drink.  I need something every now and then.  I want to know how to wake up so full of You, Jesus that I don't look for comfort anywhere but in You.  Please, help me."  I'm not suggesting that you're an alchoholic if you drink sometimes.  I'm suggesting that if you have fellowship with Jesus, you won't want to drink. 
     
    AMEN!
    Kati Rose
    • Post Points: 20
  • 10-27-2007 3:45 PM In reply to

    • Doc
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    Amen.
    Doc
    Jesus is Lord!
    www.fofmc.net
    http://cg.cfaith.com/blogs/doc
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  • 12-31-2007 11:43 AM In reply to

    • Ada
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    Doc:


    Alcohol is never approved by God in any amount by the obedient Christian.
    Alcohol is probably the most dangerous drug in any culture, because it’s complete acceptance by society, it’s total availability to the populous, and it’s devastating affect to every area of life, including families, marriages, health, safety, violence, employment and government.
    Final thought... I do not drink alcoholic liquors, I have better use for my head. To put alcohol in the human brain is like putting sand in the bearings of an engine’ ~Thomas Edison.
     
     
    Dear pastor DOC,
    This article is amazing. I love to hang out with a bunch that literally drinks till we felt high – intoxicating. I will show it to them to wake them up! 

    Ada (from Singapore) Jan 01, 2008

    • Post Points: 20
  • 03-30-2008 2:46 PM In reply to

    • Doc
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    Re: To Drink or not to Drink?

    Good Point Ada, alcohol is definetly a drug and Christians should not drink it especially servants of the Lord.
    Doc
    Jesus is Lord!
    www.fofmc.net
    http://cg.cfaith.com/blogs/doc
    • Post Points: 5
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